New to this and it's a shock.

Good morning to who may read this. I've been bumbling around this site for a day or 2 now looking at other peoples tales of woe. I must admit I feel for most that I've read and can see where most are coming from. This is terrible & scary. I never thought adult life could be so frightening. And the emotions that you go through leave you so hollow because your all spent up is just so ...so..I cannot think of a word...dehumanising?..

I found out my wife was being unfaithful to me about beginning of September. I was lost,confused and when I approached the subject all I got was vagueness and lies. Nothing was said that I could trust. It was all a pack of lies. I eventually got some evidence from e mails. Reading through some turned me sick. It was quite clear my wife had "something" going on with another man.
After confronting her with the evidence she caved in. Then we went to relate...and are still going. as far as I knew this relationship was off but oh no..it was still on. I talked to the other man who was very threatening...anyway he told me that he'd offered to back off and let us get on with relate and sort it out but she (my wife) had asked him not to back off. He's apparently back with his wife trying to make things work whilst my marriage is in tatters. After going through all this (over 5 - 6 weeks) I went through the grief cycle...all the way up to acceptance. Now I find there was another man before this last one. I obviously made a bad choice or did something to cause this mess. Anyway. My wife is playing games with me now. She's going to relate with me but she is secretly stashing cash, opening bank accounts and still trying to see tis other man. If he doesn't respond to her for the sake of his marriage I'm pretty sure she will try for someone else. The deceit continues. I find myself in an impossible situation. I have no trust for her and there is no (or very little) honesty. Yes I've been through her drawers and snooped and found out stuff I wish I hadn't but when there is no trust, no answers and just vagueness you have to do somethings you would not otherwise do. So..my loving wife has also been to a solicitor. So have I to get advice...and I told her this being the open and honest fool I was...this was 4 weeks ago...so she's been to a solicitor very recently but not told me. May have gone for advice...I can understand that...but she still hasn't told me. Coupled with a conversation with a mutual friend last night, I was told my wife is out to hurt me. Not that she can inflict any further emotional hurt the only thing that is left is our finances...which she appears to be draining slowly but surely...and probably stashing the cash somewhere.

I've had enough. We have 1 son who is so pure and Innocent. He will be the biggest victim in this and me...as a father...I think I'm screwed too. I want (or wanted) to work this out and aim for Christmas so that whatever happens our son has at least one good Christmas with his mum and dad. (I think this is for me too).
I expect a letter from my wife's solicitor as a worse case scenario so I have to be prepared that she may divorce me. This I'm not bothered about. Not sure if there is an implication to cost but that will come out of our joint accounts anyway. All I know right now is that I can't trust and there is no love. And if there is no love without passion...well then there's no loving at all and it's not worth anything. So Divorce seems to be the only option. I'm freaked out by the stories of fathers getting hammered and coming away with nothing. I have a financial question which I posted yesterday but I wish to post here too because someone reading this may have some experience on the legal side. and here is my question. If anyone can give me the benefit of their experience or if there is a legal beagle out there please please advise. Even if it's bad news I'd like to be prepared.

Here's the situation / question...Can you advise please what the considerations are in a divorce situation to these financial details.


Married to W for 14 years. Cohabited for 3 yrs prior.
H earnings = 38k pa. H = 42yrs next b/day
W earnings = 18k pa. W = 38yrs next b/day.

W due to be made redundant in Jan 2009 with settlement of 20 - 22k.

House value approx 200k
amount owed...78k = 122 equity.

W has company pension. now wound up + stakeholder.
H has private pension +1 wound up into annuity type and another personal (just started).
Not sure of pension values at the mo but would say W pension = H personal pension. So that leaves the annuity type which is from a wound up scheme.

Assets. (other than house)...Not much really.
lets say 2 cars and a caravan...all depreciating but currently say 9k the lot.

Savings...
H = PEP for 6k...will be worth about 4 - 5 at current time.
W = Pep for 2.5k...assume to be worth 2k.
about 5 - 6k in other bank accounts (joint).
W's redundancy package ...20k..(if she doesn't hide or spend it).
H = endowment = 10k
W = endowment = 10k.

Outgoings.
We have approx 3k per month from our salaries. Much is consumed with standing orders for mortgage, life assurance etc.

We have approx 4k debt from house improvements. After all debts / standing orders are paid we have approx 1k left. This buys the food, pays for fuel to run the cars, birthdays etc etc etc etc. There is nothing left at the end.

W has various s/orders for Gym, open learning course (say 100.00 these two). then there is car HP on W's car at 250 per month...for next 2 years.


1 son. 8 years old.

I paid 25k into the mortgage from inheritance to reduce the burden if that matters.

Local prices for terraced houses here range from 70 to 110 K depending on the area / size / condition. For a decent property, 2 beds (in OK area) I would expect to pay 80 - 90k.

That said a friend of mine sold his quasi semi in a good area for 105...so prices are not so bad...and falling.

Also note worthy..In order to earn 38k I have to travel to Manchester daily. This costs me 200.00 - 250.00 per month in diesel. If I did not travel to Manchester I would possibly earn about 25k locally.

My aim / hope via mediation is to retain the house by taking a mortgage out for half the equity = 60k.
Paying off any debts from the savings (which would also include W's redundancy) and splitting the residue 50%. Depending on pension difference I would surrender my annuity policy in favour of W.

Custody...Aim to have son for 10 days per calendar month + 1 weekend (i.e 1st to 10th of each month + 1 weekend). Not sure how this affects maintenance.

From whatever is in the house I will agree that W takes whatever she needs providing there is common sense and fairness (i.e I keep the dog if you take the cat)...

I think this would save time, costs (in terms of est agents).

Reason for buying W out of house (if this matters)...W cannot buy me out of house. I can buy W out. This would provide her quicker access to cash as we won't have to wait for a sale (up the road been on sale for 3 years)...Son of 8yrs will need somewhere he is familiar with and knows to come back to at any time he wishes which would not be possible if we sold.


I'm a bit unsure on W's stance with redundant position. She may well will be out of work when this all starts off. Does this affect anything? Her earning potential is anywhere between 18 - 22k pa. If she came to Manchester as I have done...she could earn 22 - 30k.



Is this reasonable do you think? Is it likely...if mediation fails or W wants to go to court..what are my chances?

Not that it makes any difference but I am the injured party in all this.

Hope I've not left anything out...

Thanks in anticipation.

Dirk.

Hiya dirk. This is far too much to tackle in one go mate. But I will have a crack at it. Its best to seperate out the emotional from the finacials.

I know this is a shock mate and the same sort of thing happened to me and others. Dont blame yourself for going thru emails and so on.Its ok. I know all about privacy and so on but that dont count. You want to know and thats fine. I felt awful going thru her emails and txt's etc. But what I found hurt. If you can try not to look. It will just hurt you more. Do you want to stand in the road in hit yrself over the head with a shovel? Exactly. So try not to hurt yourself anymore.

Relate is good.I went for about 10 weeks. I went on my own however but it did help me. So try and keep going for a bit. But you have to realise that this marriage is over and work towards ending it at relate. The counseler will help you work towards that.

Trust. When someone has an affair the trust goes instantly. In fact it goes on both sides. You cant trust anything she does and she thinks that you will inact revenge on her. So she wont trust you. The thing about spiriting money away is also common. Its a bit like being made redundant. You get as much out of the old job for as long as you can becuase you know its over.

I know that you want an angle on the finances as soon as you can. But right now its impossible to say. You are about a year or more from divorce. In that year anything could happen so dont worry about it for now.

Lastly. Many of us that have been cheated on think we are to blame in some way. This is not true. You are not to blame. You didnt take her to the meetings with these men. You didnt facilitate there affair in anyway. So you have nothing to blame yourself for. She will try and blame you. This is also common. Dont accept this blame. No one can force someome else to have an affair. People that have affairs have something wrong with them. There is often something missing from there lives that they cant get at home. If you knew what it was that was missing then you still couldnt give it to them. So dont blame yourself.

I am going to upset you now mate. You wife is no good. People that have affairs are no good. The men that had affairs with her are also no good. They have wives and family's back home and they would be as devistated as you are about this. So keep this in mind when she is telling you that this is your fault. Its not. C

Dirk,

I know you are very hurt and upset by what has happened.
It is important to remember that "blame" has no part in any financial settlement. Have a look at section 25 of the 1973 Matrimonial Causes Act to see what is considered.
.. essentially it is NEEDs first - especially the child's needs (and the PWC - parent with care). Once need have been met, and spare dosh can be divided up - but I don't think there will be any .

Of course if she has plans to cohabit this puts a completely different complexion in things ... but as things stand, this is how I would see it:

Housing NEED is for a 2 bed place apiece. Is FMH larger than that?

Wherever possible the PWC and child(ren) should remain in the FMH

Say 50k cash assets (once debts are paid) + house equity 120 – so 170k

CM – 15% of net salary so around 350 a month.

Wife will have CB and can claim tax credits as a single parent

You could get a mortgage of around 120k (best to get less though in the current climate)

You would need a deposit of some kind.

Could you move closer to work?

Wife will be assumed to be able to earn at a similar level … unless she can demonstrate that is NOT possible. There may be a need for SM on a short term basis especially if she needs to retrain.

If wife can earn at a similar level and has CM, tax credits etc, she would be able to pay a mortgage of 78k so could take on the joint mortgage but no more than that. If you had ALL the cash assets to put towards a property, that would be a 70:30 split … but you would retain all your pensions and she retain hers. Without knowing the pension values it is hard to assess whether this is a good plan.

OR you could look at a smaller cash sum … a reduction in the mortgage on the FMH AND a Mesher order – a charge on the property.

Say you had all the assets save for her redundancy – that gives you about 30k for a deposit and moving costs. From what you say, you should be able to buy a reasonable 2 bed place with a mortgage. On a 60:40 split of cash assets, there would be about 40k outstanding … that is 20% of the current value of the FMH so you could have a 20% Mesher with the usual triggers (cohabitation, remarriage, child leaves f/t education etc).

The problem you have is that there are quite a few uncertainties ... you need to try to get all your valuations etc sorted out .. and get a clearer idea of her intentions.

It really is best if you can talk to each other about the best way ahread - putting your child's needs at the top of the agenda. Dragging this through the courts would eat up every last bit of the savings etc that you have ... to get to a Final Hearing - with representation - could cost 25k+ apiece and create a level of bitterness and upset that can never be repaired.

Hadenoughnow

Hi Hadeboughnow.
Many thanks for your reply. I think you've convinced me mediation is the best route. Also, for me the FMH is important. It's a largish 4 bedroom property in a good location near sons school. I'm quite confident I can raise 80k to buy my wife out of the FMH. Bank have advised I can borrow up to a certain level that would be suicidal to do but I have a brother who is willing to loan me 20k too and pay him back "whenever" as he says. I've worked stuff out and a 60k mortgage is manageable.

If I were to move closer to work the value of property increases greatly. Manchester and surrounding areas are 1.5 to 2 times the price they are here.

I also can have the option of working from home if I need. I've agreed this with my employers already so the primary carer is up for grabs as I see it. My wife, when she gets a new job may have to travel and may have to travel / spend nights away. (judging the jobs she's looked at this is likely)...so could I become the primary carer?

The 15% of salary = CM of 350 a month is harsh but it's for my son. I suspect that's if I get no custody at all. I would be aiming to get at least 1 week and a week end in each month so that should reduce I hope...9 days...so make it 220 a month or something similar. Sure thing I would fight custody allllll the way if I thought I had the chance. and hang the cost as I'll repay it somehow.

Agree there are many variables. Whatis worrying now is that she has appointed a solicitor and had all this drawn up for herself. So she probably knows as much as me...and will be getting exited about it no doubt.

So..back to my plan..(tell me if I'm dreaming) if I offer her 60k equity of FMH (50%)and another 20k on top...that should about equal what she would get with a 70 / 30.

Aside to that there are the other bits of assets which we can negotiate on such as pensions, bank accounts and also what debts we have..which should be cleared or reduced from the value of the property (we owe about 4k on double glazing)...

I think to get the above would be costly on a monthly basis for sure but if I can prove that my offer is genuine and similar to what the court would agree in financial terms (should mediation fail)....then I hope to have a rough solution. Appreciate this can only be rough because there are so many variables.


If we make agreements and do divorce...and I end up paying SM, will this stop if my (then ex) co habits, re marries or gets a well paid job?.

I still think that my wife (lets say she is the primary carer) will get a good house for 80k deposit...and all the rest of the assets can be twiddled with till we agree....realistic?

I think I'll be living on rice and rat meat for some time to come....till I get a few pay rises under my belt anyway.


Thanks & sorry to labour it. I appreciate details are sketchy.

Dirk.

Lastly. Many of us that have been cheated on think we are to blame in some way. This is not true. You are not to blame. You didnt take her to the meetings with these men. You didnt facilitate there affair in anyway. So you have nothing to blame yourself for. She will try and blame you. This is also common. Dont accept this blame. No one can force someome else to have an affair. People that have affairs have something wrong with them. There is often something missing from there lives that they cant get at home. If you knew what it was that was missing then you still couldnt give it to them. So dont blame yourself.


Hi marshy, Do you really believe this, there have been 17 ow in my 17 year marriage, that has to be my fault.debs

soz marshy i'm trying to work out how to quote just part of your post. i'm a computer thicky !!!!!

Hi Dirk, welcome to wiki,
I was shocked with your story,and have read your replys.
there's lots of support here so take advantage of it.

Why o why do we allow this to happen to us?
I have spent years trying to work out why my stbx was repeatedly unfaithful and why I always took him back.

The guys have given you the right advice,
I'll say what I think.

Your wife needs her arse kicking ( not suggesting you do that )To have a man who thinks so much of his son and provides a secure life is a dream for most women.

She is a coward because she didnt leave the marriage first before looking for another relationship. She is playing games with you because she knows she can and knows she'll keep getting away with it.

You are worth better and when she is out of your life you will find better.

I'm going thru this journey myself so I know just what you are going thru.

And I know what you mean about blame, why should she have more when she finds it so easy to sod of to someone else.
Unfortunatly the law doesn't work like that.

keep posting, let us know how things go, big hug, debs