Not at all amicable

perrypower wrote:

Dear Mark,
You have my deepest sympathies. It is just completely outrageous when a parent can have such a high degree of control and the otehr party is forced to take court action to get it sorted out.

Why is it that some people just refuse to accept that the best parent is BOTH Parents?

Please don't over react, take sometime and think about what to do.

Thanks all

I have taken some time out Perry and all it has made me realise is that if I am patient and stick to my guns, then eventually the children will ask for me. I still see them every weekend and I take comfort from the fact that my daughter and son never once asked for her or wanted to return home. They were enjoying themselves and thats what I will try to ensure everytime they come around. The phone calls have stopped during the week, neither of us has budged on that one, so I will buy my daughter a mobile phone and ring her everynight

sorry but I disagree with one thing you have said,

There is in mho nothing wrong in saying that Mummy and Daddy don't like each other - that is infact the truth for many of us. What would be wrong would be saying Daddy or Mummy don't like/love you - the you being the child.

For me this is actually an important life lesson - and it firmly puts the fault in Mummy and Daddys camp not in the childs.

Otherwise good luck - wish my x wanted to see his children.

The problem wilsr10 in saying you don't like your ex-partner to your child is that it is a form of child abuse. If you don't like them there must be a reason, what is the reason, whether you tell the child the reason or not the child will attempt to resolve it and this casues them much emotional upset. Sometimes it is better to say nothing or to say that mommy or daddy is happier now.

I know of a couple where husband did not see children for years (many). Mother told them she disliked husband. In their teens these two girls made contact with the father and moved out to be with the father. There was no real problem with their relationship with the mother and the father was by most accounts on here a cheating git. The girls however reached the conclusion that their father did not see them becasue the mother disliked him so much not because he did not want them. Children can't believe or accept that a parent does not want to see them so unless it is handled well the assumption may well be that it is the aprent they are living with that is at fault, preventing them from seeing the other parent.

My brother's ex wife stopped him seeing his 3 children for many years..she told the children terrible lies about my brother and about us his family, they hated their dad and us for many years.. Once his son reached 16 he came to my mums house looking for his dad, he was finally told that his mother had run off with my brother best friend and that everyting she had told him about his dad and us were all lies, he felt terrible that he had judged his father and us for so long. Now his son and daughters all have contact with their dad and us they all regret the years of being without their father, grandparents, aunts, uncles and cousins.

No one can control what the other parent tells the children, when they are angry and bitter they will say nasty things to gain brownie points against the other, it sucks. I never did this with my children thankfully, I said exactly what perrypower just said " that we were happier and better people being apart from each other" and both my girls actually said that we actually were better people and of course I get on better with my ex now than I did when we were married.

perrypower wrote:

The problem wilsr10 in saying you don't like your ex-partner to your child is that it is a form of child abuse.





I am sorry Perry but I think that is a bit harsh: of-course we should all be wary of what we say about ex-partners to our children: after all children are very aware that they are part of both and can get very confused and upset to hear bad things about their mum/dad.

However, I think it is equally important to be as truthful as possible with them: my son is nearly 4 and I have struggled for a long time about how to discuss his (absent) father with him.... he has recently started asking me more and more about his dad. Most recently, he asked me if daddy and I were friends (he has started pre-school and who you are friends or not friends with appears to be very important at the moment!).

I did not lie and tell him yes: I told him that daddy and I were no longer friends, but that we both loved him very much (stretching the truth slightly as his dad has rarely shown the slightest bit of interest in him, but hey ho).
His response was that he was not friends with daddy - the implication that as daddy was not my friend he would not be his friend. I told him that daddy and I were not friends but that he and daddy could still be friends. I think he was satisfied with that (I hope).

I hope that would not be considered to be child abuse? I am not entirely sure what else I could say?

That is very judgemental I think and very dangerous. Child abuse is insidious, vicious and immoral. I am fully aware of mental and emotional cruelty.

I belive that the truth is important and the response you give probably depends on the ages of the children. Children can understand likes and dislikes from the playground - and that being friends can be a fluid relationship. I have been able to explain that whilst they are not friends with one child it doesn't mean they can't be in the same team and work together or that it stops someone else being friends with them. I may be wrong - but it isn't child abuse.

Mine are 8 and 15 and obviously what I say to each of them is different.

I do not think it wrong to say that you do not like one another - what is wrong is to stop one parent seeing the other, expressing criticism or blame.

My mantra - is You have one Mum and one Dad and they both love you.

jacsmum and wilsr10.

Parents are the most important thing in the world to children. When one parent does anything other than support the other parent, especially when they are absent we damage the child's self worth.

I didn't say it was easy or that you would always be able to tell the truth.

The very response of jacsmum's child spells out precisely what I am saying. Children see things as black and white, good and bad, friend or foe, they generally are not capable of recognising 'degrees' of friendship or relationships.

Telling children that you don't like the other parent adds nothing of value and nothing positive. It is a disservice to the child, it gives them doubts, am I half bad?

In both your cases the father ex is an absent parent. That is hard on you and hard on the children. If your children knew that you and your ex's were the best friends ever when they were born (THE CHILDREN THAT IS)and that it was the moment of greatest joy in your(including ex partners) lives do you think that would give your children more comfort?

I have the greatest regard for any parent that is left with the 'absent parent' situation. Your job is much harder than those of us with shared arrangements. That is because the other parent can stick up for themselves in the shared care situation and in theory that should keep both ex-partners in check. It doesn't always but it should.

How can an absent parent defend what is said about them, even if truthful? In both cases your children can only rely and count on you for everything, including knowing that their absent fathers love them and that they were the product of a loving relationship.

We tell our children fantasies all the time. We encourage our children to believe in Santa Claus but when it comes to telling the truth about an ex-spouse we feel completely justified in telling it like it is, from our perspective. And most importantly for who's benefit.

The best test to decide how you are going to answer a difficult question is to think how you would have answered the question if you were still married (and living together). It will give you a chance to consider what the child would have heard or what his peers (in married homes) will hear.

This is something I've learned through my experiences because sometimes in the past I was too open and too truthful and it was hurtful even when I did not mean it to be.

My Mantra is the best parent is BOTH parents.

If either of you feel offended or hurt then you have not understood the message I am trying to offer.